[Ascension]

In addition to what fixer said, maybe you can start a “psy church” at the next 3-day party and see if it catches on.

[thefixer]

Collision needs to give a holla out to Allah.

When the black helicopters land on your property and take you and all the psyowa kids away to Guantanamo Bay, they ain't gonna be asking about your religion.

[Mr. Roboto]

Those Elks know how to throw down the parties!   ;D

   

Nice

[Mr. Roboto]

What I've been thinking is, if you got a true vision you just preaching it. Not discussing endlessly on a forum how to start a religion. A religion is a spontaneous thing like getting laid. Maybe we should discuss helping Collision get some nookie instead, we could have weeks of discussion about it. And at the end he still wouldn't be getting any.

Religions are organic things – you either got the mojo or you don't. If you don't really have the fire, everyone's going to see it's a scam like Universal Life Church. Collision I think you need to talk to God and find out what he wants you to do. Charlie Manson didn't need a month long forum discussion to figure out what he was about. It's obvious you don't BELIEVE. You might as well drop this dumb idea before Wodan strikes you down bro.

Maybe this is the spontaneous thing and time with a lack of understanding and knowledge.  You had to go through puberty before getting laid.  You had to have an idea on what goes where, and someone had to share their  experience, whether right or wrong, on how how it's done. 

[thefixer]

My point is, just do it, don't worry about what is legal and what the mainstream society will think about it. Because no matter what you do, somebody is going to not like it, or think you are sinners or infidels.

One thought I had was that there is a strong link between Goa dance culture and Shivite Hinduism. Right there is a clear path to a religion – worship of Shiva through dance. Everyone should learn more about Hinduism and consider adopting the religion if they want a clear path from trance dance to Spirituality.

[Pauldo]

One thought I had was that there is a strong link between Goa dance culture and Shivite Hinduism.

…and hence a historical connection of booming the chillum in a religious context.

If an individual state were to legalize medical MJay a sincere ministry would be to tend to the sick.  Thus one's ministry could stand a local or state challenge to it's practices due to the legal of medMJ.  A ministry could also possibly stand a federal challenge because the ministry is being done out of a sincere religious belief in it's medicinal and healing properties.  In addition to trance dance beliefs and practices.  Possibly…  😉   

[NightowL]

My point is, just do it, don't worry about what is legal and what the mainstream society will think about it. Because no matter what you do, somebody is going to not like it, or think you are sinners or infidels.

One thought I had was that there is a strong link between Goa dance culture and Shivite Hinduism. Right there is a clear path to a religion – worship of Shiva through dance. Everyone should learn more about Hinduism and consider adopting the religion if they want a clear path from trance dance to Spirituality.

um, fixer, no offense or anything but… what do you think we've been doing this whole time???  i could discuss endlessly on forums how one could become spiritual, or I could just do it…. such as hosting regular risky gatherings again and again within extremely short amounts of time just to unify the few and far between that can come together and make some magic, without any financial compensation (usually resulting in the opposite).  my whole post here was in regards to how you can legally and officially be safe from government interference by doing it their way… slapping on labels so humans can identify you because you have a “name” to what you do and why you do it.  thats all what organized religion is anyway, right?

[HARDKORNATE]

  thats all what organized religion is anyway, right?

No, religions organize so they can control people and gain more power for themselves.

[thefixer]

um, fixer, no offense or anything but… what do you think we've been doing this whole time???  i could discuss endlessly on forums how one could become spiritual, or I could just do it…. such as hosting regular risky gatherings again and again within extremely short amounts of time just to unify the few and far between that can come together and make some magic, without any financial compensation (usually resulting in the opposite).  my whole post here was in regards to how you can legally and officially be safe from government interference by doing it their way… slapping on labels so humans can identify you because you have a “name” to what you do and why you do it.  thats all what organized religion is anyway, right?

I guess the point I am making is, there is no way to stop them from hassling you if they are going to hassle you. Religion is not a good way of protecting yourself. You are still going to have to sell yourself as a church which for dance spirituality in Iowa is going to be a hard sell. Religions are founded because of a vision, not because they protect your practices. You might want to read some religious histories – founders of religions often end up in a bad way. But they didn't care because their god commanded it. Do you have the same passion?

[Robyo]

My point is, just do it, don't worry about what is legal and what the mainstream society will think about it. Because no matter what you do, somebody is going to not like it, or think you are sinners or infidels.

One thought I had was that there is a strong link between Goa dance culture and Shivite Hinduism. Right there is a clear path to a religion – worship of Shiva through dance. Everyone should learn more about Hinduism and consider adopting the religion if they want a clear path from trance dance to Spirituality.

I hear ya on the whole psy scene/Shiva sect crossover. Maybe Goa parties are really just an extension of Shiva ritual?
Speaking of “Goa'n” to start a new religion, I recently read some philosophies of the Rastafarians and their use of Word-Sound-Power and how they reshaped a language into their own.

From the essay “Up-full Sounds: Language, Identity, and the Worldview of the Rastafari”, by John W. Pulis, which was presented at the annual meeting of the American Anthropological Association in 1990, “When used in reference to person, self or individual, the “I” signified the cornerstone of a renegotiated construction of identity known as 'I-n(within)-I.'” The development of “Dread Talk” (the deep Jamaican patois spoken by adherents of the Rastafarian religion/culture) was a conscious exercise in breaking down the sounds of English words and reassembling them into new words (“up-full” sounds, “heartical” sounds) that were free from the negative, divisive and misleading sounds and character the words possessed in the language of “Babylon” (meaning the language of the white colonists that had enslaved them).

For example, the de sound prefix in the word dedicate (pronounced dead-di-cate) was deleted because of its sound-sense similarity to the de sound in the English words death and destruction. The de prefix was replaced by a sound that signified its opposite, not in Creole, but in English, i.e., live, creating the up-full liv-i-cate. The un sound in words such as understand was replaced by the o sound of over as in overstand, implying that all speakers are competent, i.e., no speaker of Creole, English, or Dread Talk is under, beneath, or below another. The up sound in the word oppression was replaced by down, as in down-press-I, because [oppression pushes people down, not up]. … the suffix dom was deleted from the word wisdom because of its similarity to the word dumb…The Creole mon, i.e., man, replaced the suffix dumb creating the word-sound wiz-mon.

And everywhere in this recreation of language is “I”:

The con sound in words such as kon-scious and kon-trol was associated with the k sound in the Creole word kunni, meaning clever. [or “to con” – “to deceive”] It was replaced by the first-person pronoun I, as in I-trol and I-scious…The first person I replaced the u or you-sound, the second-person derivative, in words such as unity and human creating the words I-nity and I-man, similar to the word-sounds I-trol and I-scious.

This topic is vast,  Rastafarians and their Dread Talk language honor the “I” without violently rejecting the separate and divisive ego, but rather by transcending it through the simple removal of its place in their linguistic heritage.

“I and I embraces the congregation in unity with the Most I (high) in an endless circle of I-nity (unity).”

I think this idea extends to trance culture and rewriting culture in general.  😉

[thefixer]

What you say about Dread Talk is very interesting, I will have to look more into that, thanks.

[MOLIMO]

I just wanted to make a comment about the ghost dance.

The ghost dance was not really a boneified religion per say.  It was created under the pretense of military and colonial opposition.  The ghost dance was outlawed in the uS for good reasons.  The Ghost Dance was led by fanatics and was based off militia-like standards.  Ghost dance followers were strongly opposed to the government and white in general and they believed that they could make the buffalo come back and their dead ancestors would come back to them through military action (ie: force)… they also believed that their ghost dance shirts made them bullet proof.  If you look into the creater of the ghost dance it falls apart even more.  This is not a representation of Native American religion.  The parts of this following that has been pointed out are just facets of Native American culture and are not supported by any “religious” belief. 
This “religion” was started for the same reasons mentioned here in this forum.  True Native American religion is not religion at all, they just did what they did and fulfilled the assets of their culture.  The only reason we have Native American “Religions” today is because labels were put on them by settlers and the few religous organizations created by Native Americans are only to preserve their way of life (3000+ years in the making), but the do little of that. 

Religion is like drugs, there is no control… a psy-religion would be great at the start but then it will just lead to a bunch of wackos shaving their heads and passing out pamplets at the airport.  What I'm saying is that religion always will get off coarse of its original intentions and will get currupted by fanatism and “doctrine”.  You will still have the government on your ass (look at the Muslims, a true historical faith that has been ridiculed by the actions of fanatics) no matter what you do, so I recommend you don't risk the well being of Psy-events with labels such as religion.  You can achieve what you want to do without sujecting it to something like religious value.

I like the elk club idea…  I have been to events before that had you sign up and register as a member at the door.  Club membership can get you a lot of the things you want without jumping through as many hoops and as far as I know, no club has ever started a war or bombed a building (even though it was our own gov).

One wore thing:  I have been to events where “religious” action was expressed and although harmless, people were greatly put back by it.  Using a relious label will scare off a lot of people that you want to attend.  A lot of people aren't ready to accept that what they do could be classified as religion, they just want to go to a party. 

[Ascension]

Haha, Molimo, when you said it would turn into people shaving their heads and passing out pamphlets at the airport, it made me think of this turning into something like what happened in Fight Club.  🙂

[Machi]

I just wanted to make a comment about the ghost dance.

The ghost dance was not really a boneified religion per say.  It was created under the pretense of military and colonial opposition.  The ghost dance was outlawed in the uS for good reasons.  The Ghost Dance was led by fanatics and was based off militia-like standards.  Ghost dance followers were strongly opposed to the government and white in general and they believed that they could make the buffalo come back and their dead ancestors would come back to them through military action (ie: force)… they also believed that their ghost dance shirts made them bullet proof.  If you look into the creater of the ghost dance it falls apart even more.  This is not a representation of Native American religion.  The parts of this following that has been pointed out are just facets of Native American culture and are not supported by any “religious” belief. 
This “religion” was started for the same reasons mentioned here in this forum.  True Native American religion is not religion at all, they just did what they did and fulfilled the assets of their culture.  The only reason we have Native American “Religions” today is because labels were put on them by settlers and the few religous organizations created by Native Americans are only to preserve their way of life (3000+ years in the making), but the do little of that. 

Religion is like drugs, there is no control… a psy-religion would be great at the start but then it will just lead to a bunch of wackos shaving their heads and passing out pamplets at the airport.  What I'm saying is that religion always will get off coarse of its original intentions and will get currupted by fanatism and “doctrine”.  You will still have the government on your ass (look at the Muslims, a true historical faith that has been ridiculed by the actions of fanatics) no matter what you do, so I recommend you don't risk the well being of Psy-events with labels such as religion.  You can achieve what you want to do without sujecting it to something like religious value.

I like the elk club idea…  I have been to events before that had you sign up and register as a member at the door.  Club membership can get you a lot of the things you want without jumping through as many hoops and as far as I know, no club has ever started a war or bombed a building (even though it was our own gov).

One wore thing:  I have been to events where “religious” action was expressed and although harmless, people were greatly put back by it.  Using a relious label will scare off a lot of people that you want to attend.  A lot of people aren't ready to accept that what they do could be classified as religion, they just want to go to a party. 

nice post man, props.

[HARDKORNATE]

I just wanted to make a comment about the ghost dance.

The ghost dance was not really a boneified religion per say.  It was created under the pretense of military and colonial opposition.  The ghost dance was outlawed in the uS for good reasons.  The Ghost Dance was led by fanatics and was based off militia-like standards.  Ghost dance followers were strongly opposed to the government and white in general and they believed that they could make the buffalo come back and their dead ancestors would come back to them through military action (ie: force)… they also believed that their ghost dance shirts made them bullet proof.  If you look into the creater of the ghost dance it falls apart even more.  This is not a representation of Native American religion.  The parts of this following that has been pointed out are just facets of Native American culture and are not supported by any “religious” belief. 
This “religion” was started for the same reasons mentioned here in this forum.  True Native American religion is not religion at all, they just did what they did and fulfilled the assets of their culture.  The only reason we have Native American “Religions” today is because labels were put on them by settlers and the few religous organizations created by Native Americans are only to preserve their way of life (3000+ years in the making), but the do little of that. 

Religion is like drugs, there is no control… a psy-religion would be great at the start but then it will just lead to a bunch of wackos shaving their heads and passing out pamplets at the airport.  What I'm saying is that religion always will get off coarse of its original intentions and will get currupted by fanatism and “doctrine”.  You will still have the government on your ass (look at the Muslims, a true historical faith that has been ridiculed by the actions of fanatics) no matter what you do, so I recommend you don't risk the well being of Psy-events with labels such as religion.  You can achieve what you want to do without sujecting it to something like religious value.

I like the elk club idea…  I have been to events before that had you sign up and register as a member at the door.  Club membership can get you a lot of the things you want without jumping through as many hoops and as far as I know, no club has ever started a war or bombed a building (even though it was our own gov).

One wore thing:  I have been to events where “religious” action was expressed and although harmless, people were greatly put back by it.  Using a relious label will scare off a lot of people that you want to attend.  A lot of people aren't ready to accept that what they do could be classified as religion, they just want to go to a party. 

Well said. I was going to say something similar, but in a much less tactful way.

*cough*religion is the devil*cough*

[Author]

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